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6/22/2017 6:42 pm  #1731


Re: Scripture of the Day

COMBINATION OF [1]  THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND [2]    ACTUAL DISCUSSION WITH A TRINITARIAN - FOURTH IN A SERIES:
 
[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 558A]
 
This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,  18  Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:  19  Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.   Ephesians 4:17 – 19, [authorized King James Bible; AV]
 
And 1 Peter 4:3, [AV] “For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries:” shows we should give up our wrong ways.  Yes, many of those doing what Almighty God (YHWH) does not want knew who He is , but as stated at Romans 1:21, [AV] “Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.”  Yes, all need to per Acts 26:18, [AV] “To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.”  For those not wanting to be obedient to him, He per Romans 1:28, [AV] “And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;”  So we should per Isaiah 56:11 - 12, [AV] “Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.  2  Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.”
 
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Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
 
[2]        ACTUAL DISCUSSION WITH A TRINITARIAN - FOURTH IN A SERIES:
 
Yes, there is a lot to be learned and I will attempt to assist you in the learning process with regard Romans 9:5 that you clearly do not comprehend
 
You said,
<<<" Romans 9:5 niv
"Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them is traced the human ancestry of Christ, who is God over all, forever praised! Amen."
 
Right now it is Christ who is God over all creation. Just as the Deity of Christ denied himself of his own power in Jesus before the Cross. Now, the Father is backing off his power over all creation, and has assigned all authority of Deity over creation to Christ Jesus! God is right now God over all creation through Christ!">>>.
 

You missed it on this one:
Romans 9:5, "Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever.  Amen."  [Authorized King James Bible; AV]
 
To fully understand this scripture we must look at how other Bible translations render it and what Koine Greek experts on translation have to say about it.  Let's first look at how several other Bible translations render it:
 
Romans 9:5 "Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them is traced the human ancestry of Christ, who is God over all, forever praised! Amen." (New International Version; NIV)
 
Romans 9:5 "Whose are the fathers and of whom is Christ, according to the flesh, who is over all things, God blessed for ever. Amen." (Romans 9:5 Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible)
 
And now what several Koine Greek experts had to say with respect to Romans 9:5, it is as I said, "I see this as merely a scriptural pericope of two parts, the first being who are the fathers being discussed and the second part being a blessing of Almighty God for ever and ever. This means that the fathers here being spoken of are propably as brought out by John Gill, writer of the 'The New John Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible,' said, "Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob; for, according to the F1 Jewish writers, ``they call none in Israel (twba) , "fathers", but three, and they are Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob; and they call none "mothers" but four, and they are, Sarah, Rebecca, Rachel, and Leah:''; whereas the reflective statement, "God blessed for ever. Amen" is the standard as John Gill stated, "The apostle alludes to that well known periphrastic name of God so much used by the Jews, (awh Kwrb vwdqh) , "the holy, blessed God"; to which, by way of assent and confirmation, the apostle puts his Amen." Is a way of showing reverence to Almighty God (YHWH) much used by the Jews and the Amen on its end simply means that all who say it are in agreement as shown by the meaning of the ancient Hebrew word that has been simply transliterated into most languages per Strong as follows: "at the end-so it is, so be it, may it be fulfilled. It was a custom, which passed over from the synagogues to the Christian assemblies, that when he who had read or discoursed, had offered up solemn prayer to God, the others responded Amen, and thus made the substance of what was uttered their own. [John Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible]
 
The word "amen" is a most remarkable word. It was transliterated directly from the Hebrew into the Greek of the New Testament, then into Latin and into English and many other languages, so that it is practically a universal word. It has been called the best known word in human speech. The word is directly related-in fact, almost identical-to the Hebrew word for "believe" (amam), or faithful. Thus, it came to mean "sure" or "truly", an expression of absolute trust and confidence. (HMM)"
 
Now the one other part of this scripture, "concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all," this relates to Jesus (Jeshua or YHWH saves) being given responsibility and power for a time over all things in heaven and on earth except his Father (YHWH) by his father as shown by 1 Corinthians 15:20-28, "But as it is, Christ has risen from the dead, the first-fruits of those who have fallen asleep.  21 For since by a man come death, by a man also comes resurrection of the dead.  22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made to live.  23 But each in his own turn, Christ as first-fruits, then they who are Christ's, who have believed, at his coming.  24 Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when he does away with all sovereignty, authority and power.  25 For he must reign, until 'he has put all his enemies under his feet.'  26 And the last enemy to be destroyed will be death, for 'he has put all things under his feet.'  But when he says  27 all things are subject to him, undoubtedly he is excepted who has subjected all things to him.  28 And when all things are made subject to him, then the Son himself will also be made subject to him who subjected all things to him, that God may be all in all." (Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible).   Now let's look at some of the Bible scriptures impinging on this:
 
This is especially significant as the term "God" appears in the book of Romans 154 times including Romans 9:5, and the other 153 times so how could/should even the most ardent among those believing the error of coequality between God (YHWH) and the Son, Jesus (Yeshua), the Trinitarians will agree that Paul meant the Father (YHWH) when he said God. Now realistically how would a Trinitarian isolate Romans 9:5, this one Scripture, and switch the meaning of the term from the Father to the Son, even when a similar expression in the same epistle is applied to the Father is beyond understanding! 
 
This fact is made clear by the Bible showing that the God of Jesus (Jeshua or YHWH saves) is his Father, Almighty God, at John 20:17, "Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God." (AV); And at, 1 Peter 1:3,
" Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead," (AV); And at, Mark 15:34, " And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" (AV).
 
It is reaffirmed by the following scriptures that clearly show His Father (YHWH) gave him power to judge, heal, and remove sin by use of his Father's Holy Spirit:
Acts 10:38, " How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him." (AV); Revelation 5:13, " And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever." (AV); Matthew 9:6, " But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (then saith he to the sick of the palsy,) Arise, take up thy bed, and go unto thine house." (AV); Mark 2:10, " But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (he saith to the sick of the palsy,)" (AV); Mark 3:15,
" And to have power to heal sicknesses, and to cast out devils:" (AV); Luke 4:36, " And they were all amazed, and spake among themselves, saying, What a word is this! for with authority and power he commandeth the unclean spirits, and they come out." (AV); Luke 5:17, " And it came to pass on a certain day, as he was teaching, that there were Pharisees and doctors of the law sitting by, which were come out of every town of Galilee, and Judaea, and Jerusalem: and the power of the Lord was present to heal them." (AV); Luke 5:24, " But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power upon earth to forgive sins, (he said unto the sick of the palsy,) I say unto thee, Arise, and take up thy couch, and go into thine house." (AV); Luke 9:43, " And they were all amazed at the mighty power of God. But while they wondered every one at all things which Jesus did, he said unto his disciples," (AV); John 17:2, " As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him." (AV); And Romans 1:4, " And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:" (AV).
 
Jesus (Yeshua) used his Father's (YHWH's) Holy Spirit to give power to his Apostles:
Matthew 10:1 " And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease." (AV); Mark 6:7, " And he called unto him the twelve, and began to send them forth by two and two; and gave them power over unclean spirits;" (AV); Luke 9:1, " Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases." (AV); Luke 10:19, " Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you." (AV); Acts 3:12, " And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?" (AV); Acts 4:33, " And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all." (AV); Acts 6:8, " And Stephen, full of faith and power, did great wonders and miracles among the people." (AV) [The one who Saul played a part in his murder before he became Paul]; Romans 15:19, " Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of Christ." (AV) 
 
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6/24/2017 2:12 pm  #1732


Re: Scripture of the Day

COMBINATION OF [1]  THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND [2]    ACTUAL DISCUSSION WITH A TRINITARIAN - FIFTH IN A SERIES:
[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 559A]
 
For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.  3  For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.  Hebrews 4:2 – 3, [authorized King James Bible; AV]
 
Yes, we must be moderate in all we do, and always be seeking to do the will of Almighty God (YHWH) at all times as shown by Philippians 4:4 – 9, [AV] “Rejoice in the Lord alway: and again I say, Rejoice.  5  Let your moderation be known unto all men. The Lord is at hand.  6  Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God.  7  And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.  8  Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.  9  Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: and the God of peace shall be with you.”  
 
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Your Friend in Christ Iris89 
 
Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
 
[2]       ACTUAL DISCUSSION WITH A TRINITARIAN - FIFTH IN A SERIES:
 
Yes, there is a lot to be learned and I will attempt to assist you in the learning process with regard Philippians 2:6-8 that you clearly do not comprehend
 
So as Titus 2:1 said,  "But speak thou the things which become sound doctrine:" (AV), and reject false doctrine and teachings of men."
SECOND, Your comment,

1 Corinthians 15:23-25 (New International Version)
"But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet."
Christ is right now being what Lucifer craved and lusted for. Christ Jesus has been ordained by the Father to be the Most High over all creation! 

 
You missed it on this one.   Let's look at 1 Corinthians 15:23-25 in context; to wit, 1 Corinthians 15:20-28 and get the real message and understanding of this scripture.   1 Corinthians 15:20-28 says, "But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For he "has put everything under his feet." Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28 When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all." (NIV).
 
Now let's get a correct understanding of 1 Corinthians 15:20-28 in context.   To do so we will first consider a scripture in the Old Testament as follows, Nehemiah 9:6, "Thou Art Jehovah, even thou alone; thou hast made heaven, the heaven of heavens, with all their host, the earth and all things that are thereon, the seas and all that is in them, and thou preservest them all; and the host of heaven worshippeth thee.  (American standard Version)
 
This scripture deals with how Almighty God (YHWH) made heaven and the earth.  To start off, he first made a master worker who was the first born or first of preeminence, the Son of God, whom we know as Jesus (Yeshua), and used him as his master worker or agent in the creation of all else, see Colossians 1:15-16, "who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;  16 for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him and unto him;" (ASV); and used this master worker or agent in the creation of all else, see , Colossians 1:17-18, "and he is before all things, and in him all things consist.  18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.  19 For it was the good pleasure of the Father that in him should all the fullness dwell;" (ASV).  This is in keeping with the Jewish Law of Agencies and is basically as follows, "Jesus (Yeshua) was God's (YHWH's) appointed agent in accordance with the 'Biblical law of agency' described as, "Scripture mentions something being done by Person A, whilst another mentions it being done by Person B. This is best understood when we grasp the Schaliach Principle, or the Jewish Law of Agency, which is expressed in the dictum, "A person's agent is regarded as the person himself." Therefore any act committed by a duly appointed agent is regarded as having been committed by the principle." (The Encyclopedia of the Jewish Religion, R.J.Z. Werblowski and Geoffrey Wigoder).
 
Now let's see who the Bible says is above all else, i.e., the supreme one, at Isaiah 37:16, "And Isaiah said unto them, Thus shall ye say to your master, Thus saith Jehovah, Be not afraid of the words that thou hast heard, where with the servants of the king of Assyria have blasphemed me." (ASV); And the corresponding testimony at Revelation 14:7, "and he saith with a great voice, Fear God, and give him glory; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made the heaven and the earth and sea and fountains of water." (ASV); Now he will NOT be doing the judgment personally, but again using his only begotten son, Jesus (Yeshua) as his appointed agent to do this as recorded at  1 Corinthians 15:22-28, "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. 24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. 25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. 27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. 28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all." (AV), testifies that God (YHWH) had given his Son, Jesus (Yeshua) over all except himself when the scripture says "it is manifest that he is excepted."  
We note that at Jesus (Yeshua) here is foretold as carrying out God's (Yeshua's) assignment to him in relation to judgment and the end of the world or system, and has given Him power over all as his agent, except over Himself as recorded at 1 Corinthians 15:27 recorded above.  Also, 1 Corinthians 15:28 shows that after Jesus (Yeshua) has subdued or subjected all, He will, "then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all."   This is very important to know as it shows, first, that Jesus (Yeshua), the Son of God, is a separate or distinct being or individual from his Father, Almighty God (YHWH), and second, he is subordinate to him as a superior one and is His agent for accomplishing all tasks related to the earth at the present time; hence, they are NOT CO-EQUAL as some misguided ones try to claim to support their false doctrine or myth of them being one-and-the-same and/or simply different manifestations of the same being.  Even Jesus' (Yeshua's) title makes this clear, the Son of God, in over 40 places in the scriptures, and never once God the Son as would be required if they were one-and-the-same.
 
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6/24/2017 9:23 pm  #1733


Re: Scripture of the Day

COMBINATION OF [1]  THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND [2]    ACTUAL DISCUSSION WITH A TRINITARIAN - SIXTH IN A SERIES:
 
[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 560A]
 
And Absalom rose up early, and stood beside the way of the gate: and it was so, that when any man that had a controversy came to the king for judgment, then Absalom called unto him, and said, Of what city art thou? And he said, Thy servant is of one of the tribes of Israel.  3  And Absalom said unto him, See, thy matters are good and right; but there is no man deputed of the king to hear thee.  4  Absalom said moreover, Oh that I were made judge in the land, that every man which hath any suit or cause might come unto me, and I would do him justice!  5  And it was so, that when any man came nigh to him to do him obeisance, he put forth his hand, and took him, and kissed him.  6  And on this manner did Absalom to all Israel that came to the king for judgment: so Absalom stole the hearts of the men of Israel.   2 Samuel 15:2 – 6,  [authorized King James Bible; AV]
 
Here we have an adverse situation where Absalom, a son of King David rebelled against his father as he wanted to be king.  And 2 Samuel 18:2 – 6, [AV] deals with David’s preparing to put down his son’s rebellion, “And David sent forth a third part of the people under the hand of Joab, and a third part under the hand of Abishai the son of Zeruiah, Joab’s brother, and a third part under the hand of Ittai the Gittite. And the king said unto the people, I will surely go forth with you myself also.  3  But the people answered, Thou shalt not go forth: for if we flee away, they will not care for us; neither if half of us die, will they care for us: but now thou art worth ten thousand of us: therefore now it is better that thou succour us out of the city.  4  And the king said unto them, What seemeth you best I will do. And the king stood by the gate side, and all the people came out by hundreds and by thousands.  5  And the king commanded Joab and Abishai and Ittai, saying, Deal gently for my sake with the young man, even with Absalom. And all the people heard when the king gave all the captains charge concerning Absalom.”  This shows we should seek to live peacefully and not be seeking vain glory as shown by Phillipians 2:3, [AV] “Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves.”  
 
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Your Friend in Christ Iris89 
 
Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
 
[2]   ACTUAL DISCUSSION WITH A TRINITARIAN - SIXTH IN A SERIES:
 
Yes, there is a lot to be learned and I will attempt to assist you in the learning process with regard John 1:18 that you clearly do not comprehend,
 
You said,
<<<" John 1:18 niv
"No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father's side, has made him known."
 
Jesus is doing all the work over all creation in who and what he is. God over all creation. He is making God known to man, because he is both man, and God.">>>.
 

You missed it on this one.   Let's look at an explanation with regard John 1:18, but first how it is rendered in another Bible, "No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him." (American Standard Version, ASV)
 
Now this scripture seem straight forward and it is, but some translations did a poor job of translating it.  Let's look at how the New International Version (NIV) translates this, "No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father's side, has made him known.' Would appear to show Jesus (Yeshua) as the One and Only, but this is just an error in translation in the NIV as shown by both the Authorized King James (AV) which renders it, ""No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him." And the Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible renders it, "No one has at any time seen God.  The only-begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has revealed him."  Now some may ask, how do you determine for sure which way of translating is correct.  You do this quite simply by investigation the scripture from the Old Testament actually being quoted here by the Apostle John for the first part of this scripture which is Exodus 33:20, "And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live." (Authorized King James Bible; AV); And compare with similar scriptures in the New Testament such as John 6:46, "Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father." (AV).  Then you check the Old Testament scripture from which the Apostle John took the second part, Proverbs 8:30, where Jesus (Yeshua) while in heaven was speaking, "Then I was by him, as one brought up with him; and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him," (AV).  And cross reference this in the New Testament to John 13:23, "Now there was leaning on Jesus' bosom one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved." (AV).
 
Now of course, people have seen Jesus (Yeshua).  The Apostle John, who wrote John 1:18, saw Jesus.  He even said four verses earlier that Jesus (God according to Trinitarians) had become flesh, John 1:14, "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth." Yet no one has seen God. If John were trying to say in John 1:1 that Jesus (Yeshua) was God (YHWH) and then a few verses later say no one has seen God (YHWH), would he not need to put some type of qualifying statement explaining how this can be? Or are we to assume his readers had a firm grasp of the Duality or Trinity and needed no explanation of this paradox?  While some Bibles say "only-begotten son" the oldest manuscripts say "only-begotten god". Most Bible do not want to translate it literally that way since this would imply Jesus (Yeshua) was made a god by God (YHWH). So the New International Version (NIV) reads as I quoted above "God the One and Only". However, the footnote to the NIV reads "or the Only-Begotten". It is proper that the NIV placed that footnote in its Bible translation because we are inclined to ask, "the One and Only what?" In what way is the Son the 'One and Only God' that the Father (YHWH)is not?  John said that Jesus (Yeshua) was with God (YHWH) and yet was a god and Jesus (Yeshua) was the only begotten son of God (YHWH), the context supports a literal translation of John 1:18. Jesus (Yeshua) was the "only-begotten god". That is, God Almighty created Jesus and put him in the position of a god or mighty spirit person whom He used to create the rest of the universe.
 
While it is true that angels and men can be referred to as "gods", they were not begotten directly by Almighty God.
 
Interestingly the NIV says, John 6:27, "Do not work for food that spoils, but for food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give you. On him God the Father has placed his seal of approval." (NIV).  It is obvious that there are two individuals here: the Son of Man (Yeshua) and God the Father (YHWH).  Two separate and distinct persons.  Also notice that the Father (YHWH) places his "seal of approval" on the Son.  But nowhere in the Bible is there a Scripture where the Son, Jesus (Yeshua) places approval on the Father (YHWH). This shows or indicates that the Father is in the superior position and the Son is in the inferior position, i.e., they are NOT COEQUAL.
 
The NIV reaffirms this fact, they are NOT COEQUAL at 1 Peter 1:1-2, "Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, To God's elect, strangers in the world, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, 2 who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, for obedience to Jesus Christ and sprinkling by his blood: Grace and peace be yours in abundance." (NIV).  Once more we see two separate and distinct beings here: God the Father (YHWH) and Jesus (Yeshua) Christ.
 
Now some will say that Jesus (Yeshua) and His Father (YHWH) are one-and-the-same based on the usual out of context rendering of John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."  Well, try to keep the mental context of who Jesus was to the people who lived and studied about him when the Bible text was written.  Apart from this verse, there is no indicator that anyone of his genuine (true) followers thought that Jesus (Yeshua)was God (YHWH).  This is made clear by John 1:2, which shows, "The same was in the beginning with God." (AV); Now one can not be with someone and be that person also; And John 1:10, "He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not." (AV); Last consider John 1:14, previously quoted, and it is quite clear that they are NOT the same individual.  But two distinct individuals.  Note, some Bibles correctly render this as either as "the Word was a god," or "the Word was Divine." Both of these are in harmony with the remaining scriptures in John the first chapter.
 
The fact is that no Apostle nor any other writer of the Bible ever came out and stated that "there is One God: Father, Son, and Holy Ghost".  No example of the thousands of occurrences of YHWH and God in the original manuscripts can be shown to mean 'God in three Persons' as some falsely claim.  In fact neither the word Duality nor Trinity appear nowhere in the scriptures.  So be ye not mislead into believing the doctrines of men, but remember John 8:32, "And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free." (AV).
 
LEARN MORE ABOUT THE BIBLE AND RELIGION – BOTH TRUE AND FALSE – AT   WWW.JW.ORG

 

6/25/2017 7:18 pm  #1734


Re: Scripture of the Day

 COMBINATION OF THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND THE RARE FRUIT TREES AND VEGETABLES.   With the Scripture of the Day first.
[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 561A]
 
For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the LORD his God, as was the heart of David his father.  5  For Solomon went after Ashtoreth the goddess of the Zidonians, and after Milcom the abomination of the Ammonites.  6  And Solomon did evil in the sight of the LORD, and went not fully after the LORD, as did David his father.  7  Then did Solomon build an high place for Chemosh, the abomination of Moab, in the hill that is before Jerusalem, and for Molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon.  8  And likewise did he for all his strange wives, which burnt incense and sacrificed unto their gods.   1 Kings 11:4 – 8, [authorized King James Bible; AV]
 
This departing from the way of righteousness by King Solomon won Almighty God’S (YHWH’S) displeasure as recorded at 1 Kings 11:9 – 10, [AV] “And the LORD was angry with Solomon, because his heart was turned from the LORD God of Israel, which had appeared unto him twice,  10  And had commanded him concerning this thing, that he should not go after other gods: but he kept not that which the LORD commanded.”  And Ecclesiastes 4:13, [AV] states, “Better is a poor and a wise child than an old and foolish king, who will no more be admonished.”  To this end, Proverbs 6:27, [AV] states, “Can a man take fire in his bosom, and his clothes not be burned?”  
 
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Your Friend in Christ Iris89 
 
Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
 
[2]       Here is a Commentary on Bountiful Trees and Vegetables God (YHWH) has provided for mankind, specifically the Garcinia, Garcinia is a plant genus of the family Clusiaceae native to Asia, Australia, tropical and southern Africa, and Polynesia. The number of species is highly disputed, with various sources recognizing between 50 and about 300 taxa as specifically valid. Commonly, the plants in this genus are called saptrees, mangosteens (which may also refer specifically to the purple mangosteen, G. mangostana), garcinias or, ambiguously, "monkey fruit".
 
Garcinia species are evergreen trees and shrubs, dioecious and in several cases apomictic. Many species are threatened due to habitat destruction, and at least G. cadelliana from South Andaman Island is almost or even completely extinct already.[1]
 
The fruit has been touted by a noted television personality as a "miracle" weight loss food. However, in reality this claim is highly debated.
The fruit are a food source for several animals, such as the archduke butterflies (Lexias) of tropical eastern Asia which relish the sap of overripe mangosteens.
 
Many species of Garcinia have fruit with edible arils, but most are eaten locally; some species' fruits are highly esteemed in one region, but unknown just a few hundred kilometres away. The best-known species is the purple mangosteen (G. mangostana), which is now cultivated throughout Southeast Asia and other tropical countries, having become established in the late 20th century. Less well-known, but still of international importance, are kandis (G. forbesii) with small round red fruits with subacid taste and melting flesh, the lemon drop mangosteen (G. intermedia) with yellow fruit that look like a wrinkled lemon, and the thin-skinned orange button mangosteen (G. prainiana).
In addition, mangosteen rind (exocarp) extract is used as a spice. It figures prominently in Kodava culture, and G. multiflora is used to flavour and colour the famous bún riêu soup of Vietnam, where this plant is known as h?t ?i?u màu. Gambooge (G. gummi-gutta) yields a spice widely used in South Asia, in particular in Kerala, where it is called kodumpulli.
 
Most species in Garcinia are known for their gum resin, brownish-yellow from xanthonoids such as mangostin, and used as purgative or cathartic, but most frequently – at least in former times – as a pigment. The colour term "gamboge" references the gambooge, whose obsolete scientific name is G. cambogia.

Hydroxycitric acid, a toxic appetite suppressant found in mangosteen rind
Extracts of the exocarp of certain species – typically gambooge, but also purple mangosteen – are often contained in appetite suppressants such as Hydroxycut, Leptoprin or XanGo. But their effectiveness at normal consumption levels is unproven, while at least one case of severe acidosis caused by long-term consumption of such products has been documented.[2] Furthermore, they may contain significant amounts of hydroxycitric acid, which is somewhat toxic and might even destroy the testicles after prolonged use.[3] Fruit extracts from bitter kola (G. kola) have been claimed to be effective at stopping Ebola virus replication in laboratory tests[citation needed]; its seeds are used in folk medicine. G. mannii is popular as a chew stick in western Africa,[4] freshening the breath and cleaning the teeth.
 
G. subelliptica, called fukugi in Japanese, is the floral emblem of Mobuto and Tarama on Okinawa. The Malaysian town of Beruas – often spelled "Bruas" – derives its name from the seashore mangosteen (G. hombroniana), known locally as pokok bruas.
 
Selected species
* Garcinia heterandra
* Garcinia holttumii
* Garcinia hombroniana – seashore mangosteen, pokok bruas (Malay)
* Garcinia humilis – achachairú, achacha
* Garcinia imberti
* Garcinia indica – wild mangosteen, amsol, bhinda, biran, katambi, kokum, panarpuli, kodam-puli, ratamba, etc.
* Garcinia intermedia – lemon drop mangosteen, charichuelo
* Garcinia kola – bitter kola
* Garcinia linii
* Garcinia livingstonei – African mangosteen, Lowveld mangosteen, Livingstone's garcinia, imbe
* Garcinia madruno (Humb. & Bonpl. ex Kunth) Hammel – lemon drop mangosteen, ungüento maría, tierra amarillo, madroño
* Garcinia maingayi
* Garcinia mannii
* Garcinia mangostana – purple mangosteen
* Garcinia mestonii
* Garcinia minutiflora
* Garcinia monantha
* Garcinia montana
* Garcinia morella – batuan (Hiligaynon), ireevalsinni (Tamil)
* Garcinia multiflora Champ. – h?t ?i?u màu (Vietnamese)
* Garcinia murtonii
* Garcinia oliveri
* Garcinia opaca
* Garcinia paucinervis
* Garcinia portoricensis
* Garcinia prainiana – button mangosteen, cherapu
* Garcinia pseudoguttifera Seem. – mo?onia (Tongan)
* Garcinia pyrifera
* Garcinia quaesita
* Garcinia rubro-echinata
* Garcinia schomburgkiana
* Garcinia scortechinii
* Garcinia semseii
* Garcinia sessilis Seem. – heilala (Tongan), seilala (Samoan)
* Garcinia staudtii
* Garcinia subelliptica Merr. – fukugi (Japanese)
* Garcinia thwaitesii
* Garcinia tinctoria
* Garcinia travancorica
* Garcinia uniflora
* Garcinia vitiensis
* Garcinia warrenii F.Muell.
* Garcinia wightii
* Garcinia xanthochymus – asam kandis (Indonesian)
* Garcinia zeylanica
 
In Genesis 1:11-13, "And God said, Let the earth put forth grass, herbs yielding seed, and fruit-trees bearing fruit after their kind, wherein is the seed thereof, upon the earth: and it was so. 12 And the earth brought forth grass, herbs yielding seed after their kind, and trees bearing fruit, wherein is the seed thereof, after their kind: and God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening and there was morning, a third day. (American Standard Version, ASV)[for more details, go to  www.jw.org].
 
To view pictures of many species of Garcinia fruit and trees, go to  http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=Garcinia+Fruit&qpvt=Garcinia+Fruit&FORM=IGRE
 
The main driving force of water uptake and transport into a plant is transpiration of water from leaves through specialized openings called stomata.  Heat from the sun causes the water to evaporate, setting this ‘water chain’ in motion.  The evaporation creates a negative water vapor pressure.  Water is pulled into the leaf to replace the water that has transpired from the leaf.  This pulling of water, or tension, occurs in the xylem of the leaf.  Since the xylem is a continuous water column that extends from the leaf to the roots, this negative water pressure extends into the roots and results in water uptake from the soil.  [adapted from: http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=follow-up-how-do-trees-ca ]
 
Clearly this clever water transport system shows a superior intelligence of the Creator (YHWH).
 
LEARN MORE ABOUT THE BIBLE AND RELIGION – BOTH TRUE AND FALSE – AT    WWW.JW.ORG

 

6/26/2017 11:32 am  #1735


Re: Scripture of the Day

COMBINATION OF [1]  THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND [2]    Many Ask, Where Did Jesus Come From:
 
[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 562A]
 
They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.  23  They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the LORD, and their offspring with them.   Isaiah 65:22 – 23, [authorized King James Bible; AV]
 
 
Here the conditions that will exist under God’s Kingdom with His son, Jesus (Yeshua) as its king, are being spoken of.  And it is made clear at this time the obedient ones will enjoy per Psalms 21:4, [AV] “He asked life of thee, and thou gavest it him, even length of days for ever and ever.”  But to be counted worthy to be there we must per 1 Corinthians 15:58, [AV] “Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.”  Yes all righteous ones that seek righteousness will per Isaiah 55:1, [AV] “Ho, every one that thirsteth, come ye to the waters, and he that hath no money; come ye, buy, and eat; yea, come, buy wine and milk without money and without price.”  And at this time, all will be per Isaiah 54:13, [AV] “And all thy children shall be taught of the LORD; and great shall be the peace of thy children.”  Yes, He will provide for His elect per Matthew 24:31, [AV] “And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.”  
 
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Your Friend in Christ Iris89 
 
Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
 
[2]        Many Ask, Where Did Jesus Come From:
 
INTRODUCTION:
 
The inspired word of the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, the Bible, clearly shows that before coming to earth and being born to a Jewish girl that Jesus (Yeshua) lived in heaven with his Father, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is.    As Micah 5:2 puts it, "But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting." (Authorized King James Bible; AV).   In fact, on many occasions, Jesus (Yeshua), said that he had lived in heaven before being born as a human such as at John 6:38 and 62, "For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me." And "What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?" (AV); and John 17:4-5, "I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.  5  And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was." (AV).
 
JESUS (YESHUA) IS THE TRUE GOD (YHWH) OF ABRAHAM, ISAAC, AND ISHMAEL, CREATOR OF ALL THERE IS, MOST PRECIOUS SON:
 
Jesus (Yeshua) is the most precious only begotten Son of the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is.   He is called the first of God's creation at Colossians 1:15, "Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:" (AV).   Now what makes this Son so special to the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is?   Well John 3:16 explains, "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (AV) that he was the only begotten or first of God's creation which is also testified to at Revelation 3:14, "And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;" (AV).   In other words, Jesus (Yeshua) is the only being directly created by the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is.   The true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, used him in the creation of all other things as testified to by Colossians 1:16, "For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:" (AV); and Proverbs 8:21-31, "Jehovah possessed me in the beginning of his way, Before his works of old.  23  I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, Before the earth was.  24  When there were no depths, I was brought forth, When there were no fountains abounding with water.  25  Before the mountains were settled, Before the hills was I brought forth;  26  While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, Nor the beginning of the dust of the world.  27  When he established the heavens, I was there: When he set a circle upon the face of the deep,  28  When he made firm the skies above, When the fountains of the deep became strong,  29  When he gave to the sea its bound, That the waters should not transgress his commandment, When he marked out the foundations of the earth;  30  Then I was by him, as a master workman; And I was daily his delight, Rejoicing always before him,  31  Rejoicing in his habitable earth; And my delight was with the sons of men." (American Standard Version; ASV).   Also, Jesus (Yeshua) is referred to as the Word at John 1:14, "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth." (AV).   This shows that he was God's spokesman who delivered the messages and instructions to mankind from his Father, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, to all his Father's other sons, both spirit and human.

 
IS THE FIRSTBORN OR CREATED EQUAL TO HIS FATHER?
 
Some mistakenly believe that the firstborn or created Son, Jesus (Yeshua), is equal to his Father, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, but let's see if this is so.   As previously noted, the Son, Jesus (Yeshua), was created; whereas, his Father, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, had no beginning or end as testified to at Psalm 90:2, "Before the mountains were brought forth, Or ever thou hadst formed the earth and the world, Even from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God." (ASV).   Therefore, there is no way that the only begotten Son, Jesus (Yeshua) , could ever be equal to his Father, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is.   In fact, the Bible clearly shows that the Father, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, is greater than the Son, Jesus (Yeshua), at John 14:28 in Jesus (Yeshua) own words, "Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I." (AV); and at 1 Corinthians 11:3, "But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God." (AV).   Therefore, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, alone is per Genesis 17:1, "And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect." (AV).   Thus he is without equal.
 
SON AND FATHER HAVE HAD A CLOSE RELATIONSHIP FOR EONS:
 
Of course, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, and his first born only begotten Son, Jesus (Yeshua), have enjoyed a close association for eons - long before the creation of the starry heavens and the earth.   So, how they must dearly love each other as testified to at John 3:35, "The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand." (AV); and re-testified to at John 14:31, "But that the world may know that I love the Father; and as the Father gave me commandment, even so I do. Arise, let us go hence." (AV).   Thus, this beloved Son, Jesus (Yeshua), was just like his Father, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is.   So the Bible refers to this Son, Jesus (Yeshua), as, per Colossians 1:15, "Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:" (Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible; DRCB).   Yes, even as a human son may closely resemble his father in many ways, Jesus (Yeshua) closely resembles his Father with regard to his qualities and personality.
 
CONCLUSION:
 
The true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, only begotten Son, Jesus (Yeshua), obediently left heaven to come down to earth to live as a human being.   Now the question many may ask is how would it be possible for a spirit creature to be born as a human.   Well, to accomplish this, the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, transferred his life into the womb of a Jewish virgin named Mary.   No human father was involved as testified to at Luke 1:30-35, "And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favor with God.  31  And behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.  32  He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Most High: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:  33  and he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.  34  And Mary said unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?  35  And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Spirit shall come upon thee, and the power of the Most High shall overshadow thee: wherefore also the holy thing which is begotten shall be called the Son of God." (ASV).
 
LEARN MORE ABOUT THE BIBLE AND RELIGION – BOTH TRUE AND FALSE – AT   WWW.JW.ORG

 

6/27/2017 3:55 pm  #1736


Re: Scripture of the Day

COMBINATION OF [1]  THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND [2]    ISLAM SEEKS TO PROVOKE DO TO ITS EXTREME HATRED AND LUST FOR VIOLENCE:

[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 563A] 

And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.   Isaiah 65:21, [authorized King James Bible; AV] 

Indeed, Almighty God (YHWH) purposes for an eventual time under the reign of His son, Jesus (Yeshua) where evil will be eliminated and peaceful conditions will be the order of the day per Jeremiah 31:4, [AV] “Again I will build thee, and thou shalt be built, O virgin of Israel: thou shalt again be adorned with thy tabrets, and shalt go forth in the dances of them that make merry.”  Yes, His people will rebuild a righteous world to replace the evil one that will be destroyed and go out of business at the conclusion of the end times per Amos 9:14, [AV] “And I will bring again the captivity of my people of Israel, and they shall build the waste cities, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and drink the wine thereof; they shall also make gardens, and eat the fruit of them.”  At this time per Isaiah 62:8, [AV] “The LORD hath sworn by his right hand, and by the arm of his strength, Surely I will no more give thy corn to be meat for thine enemies; and the sons of the stranger shall not drink thy wine, for the which thou hast laboured:”   

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Your Friend in Christ Iris89 

Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
[2]       ISLAM SEEKS TO PROVOKE DO TO ITS EXTREME HATRED AND LUST FOR VIOLENCE:

Members of Islam have not changed in over 1,000 years.    Now let's look at history berifely,

Most of Islam blames the apostate (counterfeit) Christians for the Crusades, but in reality Islam caused the Crusades which were the effect or result or consequences of a malicious wrong act by Fatimid Caliph al-Hakim bi-Amr Allah. How so? Well simple, in 1009 this Caliph sacked the pilgrimage hospice in Jerusalem and destroyed the Church of the Holy Sepulchre. It was later rebuilt by the Byzantine emperor, but this event was remembered in Europe and was the spark or cause for the crusades.  

 

And today they are still committing provocations and would probably try and lay the blame on others for the consequences of their own wrong doing just as the blamed the apostate (counterfeit) Roman Catholic Church for the Crusades over 1,000 years ago.    However, I believe that Britain will not do what they should, i.e., immediately counter attack.   Let's look at the latest provocation:

<<<By JIM KRANE, Associated Press Writer [23/03/2007] 
DUBAI, United Arab Emirates - Iranian naval vessels on Friday seized 15 British sailors and marines who had boarded a merchant ship in Iraqi waters of the Persian Gulf, British and U.S. officials said. Britain immediately protested the detentions, which come at a time of high tension between the West and 

In London, the British government summoned the Iranian ambassador to the Foreign Office: "He was left in no doubt that we want them back," Britain's Foreign Secretary Margaret Beckett said after the meeting.
The U.S. Navy, which operates off the Iraqi coast along with British forces, said the British sailors appeared unharmed and that Iran's Revolutionary Guard naval forces were responsible.

Britain's Defense Ministry said the British Navy personnel were "engaged in routine boarding operations of merchant shipping in Iraqi territorial waters," and had completed a ship inspection when they were accosted by the Iranian vessels. The British sailors were assigned to a task force which protects Iraqi oil terminals and maintains security in Iraqi waters under authority of the U.N. Security Council.

"We are urgently pursuing this matter with the Iranian authorities at the highest level," the ministry said.

No one could be immediately reached for comment at either government offices in Iran or at the Iranian Embassy in Baghdad. An Iranian official at the U.N. mission in New York said he was not aware of the report and could not immediately comment.

The U.S. Navy said the incident occurred just outside a long-disputed waterway called the Shatt al-Arab dividing 

Iraq and Iran. It came as the U.N. Security Council debates further sanctions against Iran over its disputed nuclear program, and amid U.S. allegations that Iran is arming Shiite militias in Iraq.
U.S. officials had expressed concern that with so much military hardware concentrated in the Persian Gulf, just such a small incident could spiral out of control and trigger a major armed confrontation.
White House press secretary Tony Snow said the Bush administration was monitoring the situation.

"The British government is demanding the immediate safe return of the people and equipment and we are keeping watch on the situation," Snow said.[[Should they not take stronger action as permitted under international piracy laws?]]

The United States, Britain's chief ally, has built up its naval forces in the Gulf in a show of strength directed at Iran. Two American carriers, including the USS John C. Stennis - backed by a strike group with more than 6,500 sailors and Marines and with additional minesweeping ships - arrived in the region in recent months.
Rhetoric between Western nations and Iran has escalated in recent months.

Earlier this week, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei said if Western countries "want to treat us with threats and enforcement of coercion and violence, undoubtedly they must know that the Iranian nation and authorities will use all their capacities to strike enemies that attack."[[Now who is committing the acts of piracy and war - Iran.]]

Cmdr. Kevin Aandahl of the Fifth Fleet said the British crew members were intercepted by several larger patrol boats operated by Iranian sailors belonging to the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps Navy, a radical force that operates separately from the country's regular navy. 
The Iranian boats normally carry bow-mounted machine guns, while the British boarding party carried only sidearms, Aandahl said. No shots were fired and there appeared to be no physical harm done to any personnel involved or their vessels, Aandahl said.>>>

The wrong action speaks for itself with respect who is trying to provoke whom and who is committing wicked acts of false imprisonment and Piracy.

LEARN MORE ABOUT THE BIBLE AND RELIGION – BOTH TRUE AND FALSE – AT  WWW.JW.ORG

 

6/28/2017 2:09 pm  #1737


Re: Scripture of the Day

COMBINATION OF THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND THE RARE FRUIT TREES AND VEGETABLES.   With the Scripture of the Day first.
 
[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 564A]
 
For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the LORD, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end.   Jeremiah 29:11, [authorized King James Bible; AV]
 
The above scripture refers to a time when the Hebrews were being obedient to the ways of Almighty God (YHWH), and clearly let it be known that He does not change per Psalms 33:11, [AV] “The counsel of the LORD standeth for ever, the thoughts of his heart to all generations.”  He, worked for His chosen people when they were being obedient as shown at Zephaniah 3:15, [AV] “The LORD hath taken away thy judgments, he hath cast out thine enemy: the king of Israel, even the LORD, is in the midst of thee: thou shalt not see evil any more.”  And this is also testified to at
Jeremiah 31:17, [AV] “And there is hope in thine end, saith the LORD, that thy children shall come again to their own border.”  
 
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Your Friend in Christ Iris89 
 
Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
 
[2]       Here is a Commentary on Bountiful Trees and Vegetables God (YHWH) has provided for mankind, specifically the Garcinia intermedia is a species of tropical American tree which produces tasty fruit. In English it is known as the lemon drop mangosteen (a name it shares with the closely related and similarly tasting Garcinia madruno). In Spanish it is called mameyito. In Portuguese it is called achachairu. The name achachairu is also applied to Garcinia humilis, another species native to Bolivia with larger, round or egg-shaped fruit(see Achachairu). G. humilis has been commercialized in Australia under the name Achacha.
 
Growth
The fast growing tree reaches a height of about 5 meters. It is tolerant of a wide range of soils, up to an altitude of around 4000 feet. It can be grown successfully and will fruit in a large pot. It grows best with regular water in full sun in a humid environment. It tolerates high temperatures but is probably not frost hardy. It has small, whitish flowers which are perfect and makes an attractive ornamental tree, especially when in truit, which may be year round. Its leaves are opposite.
 
The wood is termine resistant and used to make posts and tool handles.
 
Propagation
The tree is generally propagated from seeds, though it can be grafted. No named cultivars are known. Seeds lose viability if dried, but can retain viability for a period of months if kept moist.

 
Fruit
The tree may fruit after as little as two years. The fruits are smooth spheres about an inch in diameter with a thin yellow, orange or red rind around a white pulp. They are edible and have an appealing sweet and sour taste. It is usually eaten out of hand, though can be used for drinks, jams and jellies.[2]
 
Distribution
Native to Central America, it is cultivated sporadically throughout the tropics.[3]
 
References
1. Jump up^ "Taxon: Garcinia intermedia (Pittier) Hammel". Germplasm Resources Information Network (GRIN). United States Department of Agriculture, Agricultural Research Service, Beltsville Area. Retrieved 2010-06-12.
2. Jump up^ http://www.fruitipedia.com/lemon_drop_mangosteen%20Garcinia%20edulis.htm
3. Jump up^ http://www.montosogardens.com/garcinia_intermedia.htm  [SOURCE - RETRIEVED FROM   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garcinia_intermedia  ON  8/5/2014]
 
In Genesis 1:11-13, "And God said, Let the earth put forth grass, herbs yielding seed, and fruit-trees bearing fruit after their kind, wherein is the seed thereof, upon the earth: and it was so. 12 And the earth brought forth grass, herbs yielding seed after their kind, and trees bearing fruit, wherein is the seed thereof, after their kind: and God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening and there was morning, a third day. (American Standard Version, ASV)[for more details, go to  www.jw.org].
 
For pictures and more information, go to,  http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/188302/
 
LEARN MORE ABOUT THE BIBLE AND RELIGION – BOTH TRUE AND FALSE – AT   WWW.JW.ORG

 

6/29/2017 12:51 pm  #1738


Re: Scripture of the Day

COMBINATION OF [1]  THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND [2]    REFORM NEEDED IN ISLAM PER AYAAN HISRI ALI:
 
[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 565A]
 
This is what Jehovah says, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel: “I, Jehovah, am your God, The One teaching you to benefit yourself, The One guiding you in the way you should walk.Isaiah 48:17, [Revised New World Translation; rNWT]
 
He is our God, and we should give heed to His book of guidance for us per Isaiah 107:43, [American Standard Version: AVS] “Whoso is wise will give heed to these things; And they will consider the lovingkindnesses of Jehovah.”  And we should make praise to him per Psalms 40:9, [AVS] “I have proclaimed glad tidings of righteousness in the great assembly; Lo, I will not refrain my lips, O Jehovah, thou knowest.”  And as shown at
2 Peter 1:2, [authorized King James Bible; AV] “Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,”  For only He can actually forsee many things that have not yet occurred as revealed at Isaiah 46:10, [AV] “Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:”  
 
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To enjoy an online Bible study called “Follow the Christ” go to,http://www.network54.com/Forum/403209/thread/1417398076/last-1417398076/Digital+Book+On+18+Part+Follow+Christ+Bible+Study 
 
Your Friend in Christ Iris89 
 
Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
 
[2]        REFORM NEEDED IN ISLAM PER AYAAN HISRI ALI:
 
Author speaks out for reform of Islam, by Lona O'Connor.
 
<<<In her homeland of Somalia - where she can never safely return - Ayaan Hirsi Ali is considered a whore, and infidel, a traitor and a blasphemer.
 
None of that is surprising, considering that she has called the prophet Mohammed a pedophile for taking a child wife.   Under threat of death since 2004, she continues to speak out for reform of Islam.
 
Ali, author of the memoir "Infidel," was in town Thursday to speak and sign books at several events....

 
Flying in the face of political correctness, she asserted that democracy and Islam are incompatible.   Her audience of 800, ...
 
One of Ali's contentions is that Islam never encountered a Renissance, a Reformation or an Enlightenment, that Islam's moderates and reformers are two few, an endangered species.
 
All of this from a woman who was brought up in strict Muslim fashion in Somalia, was deprived of her clitoris at the age of 5 and fled a proper arranged marriage by emigrating to the Netherlands.
 
There, she collaborated with Theo Van Gogh on a short film, "Submission, that included images of semi-clad women with Quaranic verses inscribed on their flesh.
 
The film so enraged Muslim extremists that in 2004 one of them shot Van Gogh to death on an Amsterdam stree, then plunged a knife into his [own] chest, pinning a note that claimed Ali would be next.   She since has been accompanied by scowling bodyguards....
 
"Islam today is not compatible with (democracy).   Islam denies the separation of religion and political affairs."
 
Democracy will only have a chance in Islamic run countries when, 'faced with the choice between Quranic command and his conscience, a man can follow his conscience," she said.
 
Taskeen Naimat, striding out in a snappy...amazement and awe that Ali could speak so freely about things that in Naimat's home country of Pakistan few would dare to voice.[In Muslim countries no true freedom of religion].
 
"A Muslim would kill her with his own hands," said Naimat, a bank officer who moved here nine years ago, "She is so brave."
 
In Pakistan, a woman who has been raped needs two men to vouch that the crime occurred, she said.[Utter nonsense as rape is a crime that almost never occurs in public, but is best proven by DNA.]
 
"I am so glad I live in this country," she [Taskeen Naimat] said. [source - The Palm Beach Post, Friday, March 23, 2007, Page 5C]>>>
 
This quote from an article in a newspaper speaks for itself with regard to how Islam treats or should I more correctly say, mistreats women.   However, many of them are two brainwashed to realize it.
 
Another article by "The New York Times" highlights the same truth, Islam does not treat women correctly.
 
<<<German judge's use of Quran riles many.   She [the judge] cites a verse {Sura of Quran] that permits some beatings [of wife] in denying a divorce.
 
Frankfurt, Germany - a German judge has stirred a storm of protest by citing the Quran in turning down a German Muslim's request for a speedy divorce on the ground that her husband beat her.
 
In a ruling that underlines the tension between Muslim customs and European laws, the judge, Christa Datz-Winter, noted that the couple came from a Moroccan cultural milieu, in which it is common for husbands to beat their wives.   The Quran, she wrote in her decision, sanctions such physical abuse.
 
News of the ruling brought swift and sharp condemnation from politicians, legarl experts and Muslim leaders in Germany, many of whom said they were confounded that a German judge would put seventh-century Islamic religious teachings ahead of German law in deciding a case of domestic violence.[Admittance this is part of Quaranic teachings].
 
The court in Frankfurt abruptly removed Datz-Winter from the case on Wednesday, saying it could not justify her reasoning.   The woman's lawyer, Barbara Becker-rojczyk, said she decided to publicize the ruling, which was issued in January, after the court refused her request for a new judge.
 
"It was terrible for my client," Becker-Rojczyk said, "This man beat her seriously from the beginning of their marriage.   After they separated, he called her and threatened to kill her."...
 
While the verse Datz-Winter cited does say husbands may beat their wives for being disobedient - an interpretation embraced by Wahhabi and other fundamentalist Islamic groups - mainstream Muslims long have rejected wife-beating as a medieval relic.[Clearly admitting they did it in medieval times even though it is completely wrong.]...[source - "The New York Times," and "The Palm Beach Post, Friday, March 23, 2007, page 22A].
 
Again, the article says it all. This quote from an article in a newspaper speaks for itself with regard to how Islam treats or should I more correctly say, mistreats women.   However, many of them are two brainwashed to realize it.
 
LEARN MORE ABOUT THE BIBLE AND RELIGION – BOTH TRUE AND  FALSE – AT   WWW.JW.ORG

 

6/30/2017 2:16 pm  #1739


Re: Scripture of the Day

COMBINATION OF [1]  THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND [2]    MAKING THE WRONG ASSUMPTION WITH REGARD GOD'S (YHWH) NAME:
 
[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 566A]
 
Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil;   Hebrews 6:19, [authorized King James Bible; AV]
 
It is imperative that we draw close to Almighty God (YHWH) and let His active force work on us per Acts 10:45, [AV] “And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.”  And as shown at Acts 15:8, [AV] “This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.” Most are NOT stedfast to Him.  But He will work miracles toward the steadfast per Hebrews 2:4, [AV] “God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?”  
 
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To enjoy an online Bible study called “Follow the Christ” go to,http://www.network54.com/Forum/403209/thread/1417398076/last-1417398076/Digital+Book+On+18+Part+Follow+Christ+Bible+Study 
 
Your Friend in Christ Iris89 
 
Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
 
 
[2]       MAKING THE WRONG ASSUMPTION WITH REGARD GOD'S (YHWH) NAME:
 
Some make an assumption which is not reasonable with respect the name of the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, and Jacob, creator of all there is.   Since the apostles were quoting Old Testament which even some making this false assumption admit contained "YHWH" at these places.    One such individual said,
<<<" The name is used in a few Bibles in the NT either in its English forum or as the Tetragrammaton.
 
I am NOT asking about the use of "YHWH" in English translations of the Bible. I am asking about the use of "YHWH" in the Greek.
 
If I recall correctly Jesus Himself quoted an Old Testament Scripture that uses the term "YHWH" - in the Hebrew. Quoting David, Jesus said " 'The Lord said to my Lord.......'" Now in the Hebrew Old Testament "YHWH" is used in the first instance; while "ADONAI" is used in the second; in the GREEK New Testament the term "kurios" is used in both instances. The Greek text makes NO distinction between "YHWH" and "ADONAI".
 

Thus the apostles, by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, made NO distinction btween "YHWH" and "ADONAI". Why not?">>>
 
Let's look at the facts:
 
First, <<<" "...the most common "error" made by most translators in the last 3500 years...is their elimination of heaven's revealed Name of the Most High, Yahweh(Jehovah)" -[source - quoted from - A. B. Traina; in the Preface of the Holy Name Bible].
 
Second, <<<"THE REASON GOD'S NAME IS MISSING FROM MANY BIBLES
"...the distinctive Hebrew name for God - usually transliterated Jehovah, is in this translation
represented by "LORD." - Today's English Version (preface).   There are many different reasons why God's name was removed from the Bible. I will attempt to briefly discuss them here.
First off, it was a MISTAKE to remove God's Name from the bible.   WHY ?
 
As Author of the Bible, Only God himself has the right to change or alter the Bible. God himself
gave mankind a warning - in his own Word - The Bible; to NOT add to - NOR take away from his Words.   "I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book.   And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life." (Revelation 22:18,19)(NIV)-BibleGateway
 
- A MISTAKE - "...the suppression of The Name (Jehovah) has entailed upon the reader,
and especially upon the hearer, irreparable loss...   its suppression was a MISTAKE..."
--Rotherham, 1, Ch. IV, 22-29 "...the most common "ERROR" made by most translators in the last 3500 years...is their elimination of heaven's revealed Name of the Most High, Yahweh (Jehovah)" - A. B. Traina; in the Preface of the Holy Name Bible "The substitution of the word "Lord" is most unhappy; for...it in NO WAY represents the meaning of the sacred name (Jehovah)..."  - The 1872 edition of Smith's Bible Dictionary THE BASIC REASONS THAT TRANSLATORS REMOVED GOD'S NAME FROM THE BIBLE :
 
1. Anti-Semitic Feelings
The Jewish God of the Jewish Messiah was hated and despised by the Greeks and Romans.
When Christianity became a State Religion of Rome - All attempts to blot out the Hebrew origins of Jesus were employed - and Removing God's Name from the Bible was a major attempt to obscure Jesus' Jewish heritage.  "Well, be assured that the God that the Jews worship - is the very same God that we worship.   Their sacred writings, the Law and the Prophets, we revere and read aloud in our meetings.   And because we worship this God of the Jews, the one thing we cannot be accused of is novelty."  --Glimpses Issue #139 : Why Early Christians Were So Despised; Ken Curtis PH.D., Beth Jacobson, Diana Severance Ph.D., Ann T. Snyder and Dan Graves. (c)2003, by Christian History Institute.   "The Octavius of Minicius Felix" ; 2nd century A.D.
 
2. Support of Trinitarian Doctrine When Rome voted to adopt the Trinity doctrine of
the numerous Pagans in her empire - The Name of God - YHWH (translated Jehovah in English) - interfered and hindered the Newly Adopted teaching    That Jesus was the Almighty God - Jehovah.   Rome paid her translators to remove God's name almost Seven Thousand Times (7,000) from the Bible.   "In the first two centuries nearly all the various readings of the New Testament came into existence, the majority of them by deliberate alteration of the text...in the
interests of (the trinity) dogma..."   -the Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics; The Bible in the Church "Codex B (Vaticanus)...was altered by a later hand in more than two thousand places. Eusebius, therefore, is not without grounds for accusing the adherents of....the newly-risen doctrine of the trinity of falsifying the Bible..."  -(Fraternal Visitor 1924, p. 148;
translated from Christadelphian Monatshefte).   "The removal of the Tetragrammaton (Jehovah)
from the New Testament and its replacement with the surrogates KYRIOS and THEOS blurred
the original distinction between the Lord God and the Lord Christ, and in many passages
made it impossible which one was meant.   As time went on...it was often impossible to distinguish between them. Thus it may be that the removal of the Tetragrammaton (Jehovah)
contributed significantly to the later...Trinity "  - George Howard, Bible Scholar ;
The Name of God in the New Testament, BAR 4.1 (March 1978), pg 15`
"It was they who demanded, in effect, that Christianity be "updated" by blurring
or even obliterating the long-accepted distinction between the Father and the Son."
- When Jesus Became God by Richard E. Rubenstein, p.74
 
3. MONEY
Because the God of Christ - The Jewish God, Jehovah, was not popular with the world of mankind, they sought to remove him from their Bibles. Bible translators knew that for their Bibles to be purchased they would need to appeal to their readers. They also knew, that if they used God's Divine Name Jehovah, then people would not purchase their Version and thus
they would lose money.   God's name Jehovah/Yahowah appears in the original hebrew
text about 7000 times, but the NIV fails to mention it even once.   When asked about this, Edwin H. Palmer, Th.D., Executive Secretary for the NIV's committee wrote :   "Here is why we did not : You are right - that Jehovah is a distinctive name for God and ideally we should have
used it. But we put 2 1/4 million dollars into this translation and a sure way of throwing that
down the drain is to translate, for example, Psalm 23 as, 'Yahweh (Jehovah) is my shepherd.'
Immediately, we would have translated for nothing.    Nobody would have used it (or purchased it).  Oh, maybe you and a handful [of] others.   But a Christian has to be also wise and practical.   We are the victims of 350 years of the King James tradition.    It is far better to get two million to read it- that is how many have bought it to date- and to follow the King James, than to have two thousand buy it and have the correct translation of Yahweh(Jehovah)
. . . It was a hard decision, and many of our translators agree with you."   - The Reason NIV removed Jehovah's Name Edwin H. Palmer, Th.D., Executive Secretary for the NIV's committee
 
"The situation today, where many translations...  exists largely because of the amount of money
to be gained..." -(The Preservation of the Bible By Faithful Churches) --By Charles V. Turner
 
4. MAN MADE "TRADITION"
It was a tradition of the Jews to avoid using God's name altogether. They stopped all mention of him.  No longer using God's Divine Name, they no longer used it in their prayers, even making it a sin to say his name out loud. They considered it "blasphemy" to utter the name of God, ehovah. Many translators admit to following this "Jewish Tradition" and have thus removed Jehovah's name and replaced it with Titles such as "LORD" and "GOD" - all in capitals - to show that they have removed God's name in those places.  Jesus condemned the man-made tradition of the Jews.
Following their lead in this - would be directly against Jesus' Teachings on this issue.   "...Yahweh (Jehovah), is the proper personal name of the God of Israel...the term Adonai, 'My Lord'  was later used as a SUBSTITUTE. The word LORD in the present version represents
the TRADITIONAL usage."  - New American Bible (Catholic) Introduction to the O. T., Page XI.   "In this translation we have followed the orthodox Jewish TRADITION and substituted 'the Lord' for the name 'Yahweh' (Jehovah)" -- Preface - 1935 Bible ; J. M. Powis Smith and Edgar J. Goodspeed, "Jesus replied, "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?   ...Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition. "
(Matthew 15:3,6)(NIV)-BibleGateway
 
5. SUPERSTITION
During the time when Israel was in slavery to Babylon, she absorbed and adopted many Babylonian customs and ideas. One of these was the "Superstition" against using the name of a God - for fear that bad things would happen to them. As the Babylonians called their Chief
God - Marduk by the title "LORD" so as not to offend him, so too - the Jews adopted this idea in reference to Jehovah God.   "When the Yisraeli (Israelites) came out of Babylonian captivity, they brought along with them the Babylonian culture, and along with it Babylonian beliefs and
superstitions. One of these pagan Babylonian practices or beliefs was called "ineffability."   This was the SUPERSTITION against using the name  of a deity for fear of something bad happening to them.   The idea was that if you said the name of a deity he or she would notice you. The pagan practice of ineffability was further reinforced by Greek Hellenization." -(b.Pes. 50a) (b.Kidd. 71a).   "The avoidance of the original name of God (Yehowah) both in speech and, to a certain extent, in the Bible.....first arose.....in Babylonia. According to Dalman (l.c. pp. 66 et seq.),"  -The Jewish Encyclopedia TETRAGRAMMATON; by Crawford Howell Toy, and Ludwig Blau
 
"The idea that only the priest could utter The NAME of The HEAVENLY FATHER, and that he was to disguise or hide it from the common people, came from the idea that the NAME was "ineffable" or "unutterable". However this was a pagan doctrine that they adopted from the Egyptians, Babylonians, and the Greeks..."  -THE FINAL REFORMATION; KOSTER P.54, P112
 
Marduk was, therefore, a very important god of Babylon.   In the first millennium BCE, his name was considered so holy, that it was almost never pronounced; instead, people said and wrote Bêl, 'LORD'.   Herodotus correctly calls the supreme god of Babylon Bêl ("lord"), because his real name was not pronounced.   -[Herodotus, Histories 1.181-2; tr. Aubrey de Sélincourt].   "The ineffability of divine names was on old idea in Egypt... the name of Osiris himself was said to be ineffable...the name Marduk of Babylon was also declared ineffable. The Greeks avoided the names of their deities and preferred to call them by the titles Kurios and Theos."  -The Final Reformation By Dr. Koster; pp. 54 and 112  "...But at least by the third century B.C.E. the pronunciation of the name YHWH (Jehovah) was avoided, and Adonai, "the Lord," was substituted for it..."  - Encyclopedia Judaica (p. 679).   "The Hebrews considered The Name of God to be 'ineffable' and substituted in reading Adonai (My Lord)."  -Columbia Encyclopedia Vol. 2 under the subject 'God'
 
 
6. "JEHOVAH" IS NOT THE HEBREW WAY TO SAY GOD'S NAME
Some Bible Translators say that they have removed God's name from the Bible - because Jehovah is not
the proper way to say God's name in Hebrew.   This reasoning is merely an excuse and not a reason
at all. For if this reason was valid, then we would also have to remove Jesus name from the Bible,
since the name "Jesus" is not the way that it was written or spoken in Hebrew either. Many Hebrew
names are written in the Bible - which are not as they were in Hebrew and yet we do not remove them.
Therefore this reasoning is truly invalid. Examples of Jewish names in the Bible which are translated
into English - much differently than their original Hebrew couterparts - are : Jesus, Jeremiah, Jonah,
Joel, Jerusalem, Joshua, etc.   "... the Committee... is, omitting the name of God (because) the word 'Jehovah' does not accurately represent any form of the Name ever used in Hebrew..."    - The Preface of the Revised Standard Version
 
Thus, the Hebrew "ye-ru-sha-LA-yim" became "Jerusalem"; "ye-ri-HO" became Jericho; and "yar-DEN" become "Jordan".    Hebrew personal names such as "yo-NA" became "Jonah", "yi-SHAI" became "Jesse"  and "ye-SHU-a" became "Jesus".   Likewise "YHWH, Yahweh, or Yehowah" became "Jehovah" in english.
 
7. GOD DOESN'T NEED A NAME
God does not need to be distinguished from other gods.   Some translators have made this statement. Who are we to say that God doesn't need a name ? God deemed it necessary to name all the stars in the heavens, and to place his name upon people that he liked, and upon places that were important to him. His own word the Bible - emphasizes the importance of a name. The translators of the Bible did not remove Satan's name from the Bible - nor did they remove the names of  numerous false gods from the Bible.
"the use of any proper name for the one and only God...  is entirely inappropriate for the universal faith of the Christian Church."   -the preface of the Revised Standard Version; Under reasons (excuses) for the removal of  God's personal name - Jehovah "He determines the number of the stars and calls them each by name."   (Psalms 147:4)(NIV)-BibleGateway,  "Lift up your eyes on high, and see who hath created these, that bringeth out their host by number; he calleth them all by name...  The everlasting God, Jehovah, the Creator of the ends of the earth..."   (Isaiah 40:26,28)(ASV)-BibleGateway "A good name is more desirable than great riches; to be esteemed is better than silver or gold." (Proverbs 22:1)(NIV)-BibleGateway, "A good name is better than oil of much worth..."  (Ecclesiastes 7:1)(NLV)-BibleGateway
 
 
"...The Sacred Name Yahovah was revealed to man by Yahovah Himself and is not a man-given name"  -(see II Apol., 10, 13; Trypho, 126, 127).  In the Bible, refusing to mention the name of a god
means refusing to worship this god (Ex 23:13) and that is why Satan incited the Israelites,
by means of the prophets of Baal, not to use the Name of Jehovah (Jr 23:27).   "Yahweh (Jehovah) is the name that indicates the God of the Hebrews.   Where the Philistines worshipped Dagon, the Egyptians, Amon, and the Ammonites, Milcom, the Hebrews worshipped YAHWEH (Jehovah).   The title 'god' (elohim) is ALSO applied to false deities in the Scriptures as well as Yahweh (Jehovah), hence is NOT a term by which one can be distinguished from the others.    When the voice said, 'I am Yahweh (Jehovah),' there was no doubt in any listener's mind as to the identity of the speaker.   He was the God of the Hebrews.   So far as is known, no other peoples called their god by this name."   - Review and Herald, December 16, 1971
 
"In the Scriptures there is the closest possible relationship between a person and his name, the two being practically equivalent, so that to remove the name is to extinguish the person. (Num. 27:4; Deut. 7:24)
To forget God's name is to depart from Him."  -Zondervan Pictorial Bible Dictionary, p. 571 (1964)[source -http://www.xanga.com/item.aspx?user=RemovingGodsName&tab=weblogs&uid=329800252 ]
 
[[Special notes and sources of additional information:
"non-superstitious Jewish translators always favored the name Jehovah in their translations of the Bible.
On the other hand one can note that there is NO Jewish translation of the Bible with Yahweh."   To go more indepth on this, check out the works of Dr. Gerard Gertoux, one of the greatest living Hebrew scholars, and President of the French Bible Society. (Association Biblique de Recherche d'Anciens Manuscrits).  He has written several books on the subject.   For a quick abstract of his latest book, go to,
 
On the Name of the True God of Abraham [By Gérard Gertoux, President of the French Bible Society] at,
 
http://religioustruths.proboards59.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=only&thread=1163271234&page=1]]
 
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7/01/2017 12:21 pm  #1740


Re: Scripture of the Day

COMBINATION OF [1]  THE SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY AND [2]    Tetragrammaton Use in the New Testament - Data:
 
[1]       SCRIPTURE OF THE DAY [VOL. 567A]
 
A merry heart doeth good like a medicine: but a broken spirit drieth the bones.   Proverbs 17:22, [authorized King James Bible; AV]
 
Yes, this is a contrast between the fruits of a merry heart and a broken spirit, and this contrast is pointed to also at Proverbs 12:25, [AV] “Heaviness in the heart of man maketh it stoop: but a good word maketh it glad.”  And again at Proverbs 15:13, [AV] “A merry heart maketh a cheerful countenance: but by sorrow of the heart the spirit is broken.”  But a broken spirits result is spoken to at Psalms 22:15, [AV] “My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.”  
 
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To enjoy an online Bible study called “Follow the Christ” go to,http://www.network54.com/Forum/403209/thread/1417398076/last-1417398076/Digital+Book+On+18+Part+Follow+Christ+Bible+Study 
 
Your Friend in Christ Iris89 
 
Francis David said it long ago, "Neither the sword of popes...nor the image of death will halt the march of truth. "Francis David, 1579, written on the wall of his prison cell." Read the book, "What Does The Bible Really Teach" and the Bible today, and go to WWW.JW.ORG!
 
[2]        Tetragrammaton Use in the New Testament - Data:
 
Most New Testaments do no contain the Tetragrammaton, but Matthew 6:9, "After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name." (Authorized King James Bible; AV) clearly shows his name as represented by "YHWH", called the Tetragrammaton belongs there. 
 
Now let's look at some information with regard this fact.
 
FIRST, <<<"Tetragrammaton in the New Testament :[Note ?? marks appear where foreign alphabet characters appeared in quoted test.]
Archaeologists have discovered papyrus fragments of the New Testament dating as far back as the middle of the second century. Of all 5,000 extant manuscripts, none contains either the Hebrew (????) or Greek transliterations (?aß?) of the Hebrew name ????. One of the most ancient fragments, the papyrus codex designated Chester Beatty Papyrus No. 2 P46, is dated prior to AD 200 and contains nine of the apostle Paul's letters. In the Chester Beatty papyri, we find ?S and sometimes TS with a horizontal bar above them where the tetragrammaton occurs in the Hebrew text. These are abbreviations for kurios (?????? "lord") and theos (?e?? "god"). Some scholars think that these abbreviations were not part of the autographs and thus were added some time later,[1] concluding that YHWH did indeed occur in the NT.[2]
An article by George Howard in the March 1978 issue of Biblical Archaeology Review set forth a theory that YHWH appeared in the New Testament and that "the removal of the Tetragrammaton from the New Testament and its replacement with the surrogates kyrios and theos blurred the original distinction between the Lord God and the Lord Christ."[3]
 

YHWH and the Septuagint
The Greek Old Testament that Early Christianity used (as opposed to other Greek Old Testaments) is known as the Septuagint (q.v.). Christ and the Apostles quoted extensively from it.[4]
In the Middle Ages when St. Jerome, a Roman Catholic classicist, began his translation of the Old Testament into Latin, he switched from using the ancient Septuagint as his source to the then new Masoretic texts.[5] Jerome was the first to translate from a Masoretic Old Testament and brought YHWH for the first time into texts officially adopted by the Western Church. This use of the Masoretic did not affect the Eastern Churches and the bulk of the late Roman Empire's population, who spoke Greek.
Jesus quoted numerous times from the Old Testament, including his replies to the tempter: "Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God" (Matt. 4:7, KJV). Here as elsewhere, he quotes from the Greek Septuagint.[6][7]
The New Testament overwhelmingly quotes the ancient Septuagint, not Medieval Masoretic versions.[8] Complete copies of the Septuagint do not contain the word YHWH;[9] however, older fragments do contain YHWH. [10] It is also noteworthy that in the P. Ryl. 458 (perhaps the oldest extant Septuagint manuscript) there are blank spaces, leading some scholars to believe that the tetragrammaton must have been written where these breaks or blank spaces are.[11]
In addition to older fragments containing YHWH, a transliterated Hebrew word, "Hallelujah" includes the abbreviation of the Divine Name and appears four times in the 19th chapter of the Book of Revelation. In addition, names such as Jesus mean "YHWH is Salvation"; John, "YHWH has been gracious".[12] appear frequently in the New Testament.
Professor George Howard, of the University of Georgia, theorizes: "When the Septuagint which the New Testament church used and quoted contained the Hebrew form of the divine name, the New Testament writers no doubt included the Tetragrammaton in their quotations."[13] Thus some contemporary publishers of modern versions of the New Testament insert the word "Jehovah" in place of the Greek manuscript wording.[citation needed] In one of these (the New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures, published by the Jehovah's Witnesses), the name "Jehovah" is inserted 237 times.[14] They believe that when the NT writers quoted the Greek Septuagint or quoted the Hebrew text, where the Tetragrammaton appeared, they would have been obliged to include the Tetragrammaton. In this regard, some have charged the New World Translation Committee (NWTC) with not be consistent.[15] However, Rolf Furuli stated that there never was a rule to always use "Jehovah" since the NWTC clearly indicates other factors must be consider too. [16] A literal translation of ?e?? would be "God", and of ??????, "Lord".
 
Other Greek Old Testaments
In regard to the Septuagint, some rudimentary mistakes are made by confusing it with several other Greek versions of the Old Testament. Inherent in such error is the assumption that all Greek versions of the Old Testament were the Septuagint. This is not the case.
Origen categorized at least seven different Greek versions of varying quality: the versions of Aquila, Theodotion, Symmachus, and lesser versions that he labeled the Quinta, Sexta and Septima. Origen compiled his Hexapla (and Tetrapla) as a reference for Christians debating the Old Testament with ancient Jews.[17] The Hexapla is almost completely lost, and these other versions exist only in small fragments, mostly from the Hexapla. A few more of these fragments have also been discovered in Qumran, and two of these fragments from unidentified Greek versions have YHWH in Semitic script written or inserted afterwards. The Qumran manuscripts were those kept by a small sect of Jewish separatists known as the Essenes.
Since the church of New Testament times as well as mainstream Jews used the Septuagint, and since it is well established that the New Testament quotes the Septuagint extensively (and apparently exclusively), the other texts may not be relevant to the text of the New Testament, and texts used by the Essenes are less so. As noted in the beginning of this article, manuscripts and textual analysis of the Septuagint are extensive. The same applies to the New Testament.
 
References
1. ^ G.D. Kilpatrick Etudes de Papyrologie Tome Neuvieme, Le Caire, Imprimiere de L'Institut Francais d' Archaeologie Orientale 1971 p. 221,222
2. ^ The Anchor Bible Dictionary 1992 "Names of God in the OT, Yahweh (deity)
3. ^ The Name of God in the New Testament BAR 4.1 March 1978 15.
4. ^ Jones.
5. ^ Jones. "The Septuagint in Early Christian Writings"
6. ^ Lee, Randy and Richard Anthony, Devoted to Truth - Answers to Questions about the Word of God, "Comparisons between the Bible and the Septuagint."
7. ^ Jones. "Occasions where the Septuagint is quoted in the New Testament against the sense of the Hebrew text."
8. ^ Jones, R. Grant, Ed. Various Religious Topics, "Occasions where the Septuagint is quoted in the New Testament against the sense of the Hebrew text."
9. ^ Brenton, Sir Lancelot Charles Lee, Trans. The Septuagint with Apocrypha: Greek and English, Facs, Hendrickson. (London: Samuel Bagster & Sons, 1851).
10. ^ The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology Volume 2, page 512
11. ^ Paul Kahle, The Cairo Geniza (Oxford:Basil Blackwell,1959) p. 222
12. ^ The New Compact Bible Dictionary Edited by Alton Bryant
13. ^ (Biblical Archaeology Review, March 1978, page 14)
14. ^ BeDuhn, Jason D., Truth in Translation - Accuracy and Bias in English Translations of the New Testament, p 169.
15. ^ Eg. In the book, "The Jehovah's Witnesses' New Testament" by Robert Countess, He states that they are only 95 percent consistent in its renderings of kurios p.34
16. ^ In the book The Role of Theology and Bias in Bible Translation by [Rolf Furuli], He states that " the immediate context is the final criterion for what words should be used....[and the] truth is, the NWT translators time and again appeal to the context." pg. 97
17. ^ Maas, A.J. Catholic Encyclopedia, "Versions of the Bible."
 
See also
* Koine Greek, the language of the New Testament and the Septuagint.
* YHWH, a Hebrew name for God that appears in the Masoretic Old Testament.
* Jehovah, a common English vocalization of Hebrew YHWH.
* Iaoue, the ancient Greek rendering of YHWH.
* Yaw, an article that discusses some linguistic theories involving YHWH.
* Jehovah's Witnesses, a religion that teaches that YHWH was written in the original New Testament.
 
External links
* Greek text - Complete Greek text of the Septuagint hyperlinked to Strong's concordance.
* Brenton's - The standard English translation of the Septuagint (hard copy has Greek in column)
* The New Testament and the Septuagint - Instances where the New Testament quotes the LXX against the Masoretic Hebrew
* The New Testament and the Hebrew OT - Instances where the New Testament agrees with the Masoretic Hebrew meaning
* Names in the Septuagint and Masoretic - A table of the older Greek names with the newer Masoretic renditions, in the Old Testament
* The Septuagint Online - Comprehensive site with scholarly discussion and extensive links to texts and translations
* Versions of the Bible - Thorough entry on versions of the Bible in the Catholic Encyclopedia.
* [jehovah.125mb.com] - Discusses the divine name in the New Testament, Bible issues, history ot the divine name.
* The Tetragrammaton and the Christian Greek Scriptures - an online book criticizing the view that the Tetragrammaton appeared in the original New Testament text.
[source - Wikipedia, http://www.answers.com/topic/tetragrammaton-in-the-new-testament ]>>>
 
SECOND, Some modern Bibles using "YHWH" the Tetragrammaton in the New Testament:
 
* Bibelarchiv Vegelahn New window
A very consciencious collection by Karlo Vegelahn of German Bible translations with a special focus on their use of the Divine Name. Many illustrations. Well done Brother!
in Research Translations & Translators > About Translations > German Translations with german jehovah yhwh
www.bibelarchiv-vegelahn.de/
* New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures New window
One of the very best study Bibles.
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with bible english jehovah nwt yhwh  www.watchtower.org/bible/index.htm
* Updated Bible Version (UPDV) New window
The UPDV Bible is based on the American Standard Version of 1901 (ASV). The ASV was used as the starting point for this Bible. However, a significant amount of new research is now available regarding ancient manuscripts (such as the Dead Sea Scrolls) and word meanings. This has been integrated into ...morethe UPDV Bible to improve accuracy. For this reason, the following authoritative texts were used for further refinement of the translation: Old Testament: Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia; United Bible Societies' Preliminary and Interim Report on the Hebrew Old Testament Text Project; and the final report in Critique Textuelle De L'Ancien Testament. New Testament (Greek): United Bible Societies--The Greek New Testament, Fourth Edition; and Nestle-Aland--
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with asv bible english yahweh yhwh by 2 users
www.updated.org/
 
* Updated Bible Version (UPDV) New window
The UPDV in the StudyLight format.
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with asv bible english yahweh yhwh
www.studylight.org/desk/?l=en&query=Genesis+1&se.....anslation=ubv&oq=ge%25201&new=1&nb=ge&ng=1&ncc=1
 
 
* Non-Ecclesiastical New Testament New window
Trans. Frank Daniels (ca. 1995-2000). Uses "Yahweh". "The translation largely follows the 26th/27th edition of the Greek New Testament, called the Nestle-Aland text, although in some books, particular manuscripts (usually the oldest or most reliable) have been given a greater weight. The recent anal ...moreysis by Young Kyu Kim (Biblica 69, 1988) which redates manuscript p46 to the late first century has not escaped attention. A comparison has been made to any or all of the following translations: KJV, RV 1881, ASV, RSV, Emphatic Diaglott, Original New Testament (by Schonfield), NASB, NAB, and NIV, with more comparisons being made in more difficult sections of the text. It is this translator's effort to provide a translation as free of tradition as possible,"
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with english nt yahweh yhwh
members.aol.com/egweimi/order.htm
 
* Restored Name King James Version New window
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with bible english kjv yhwh
www.eliyah.com/Scripture/
 
 
* Revised Murdock Translation New window
A Literal Translation from the Ancient Aramaic and Syriac Versions. This is the gospel of Matthew of a work under progress. Uses "Yahweh".
in Online Bible Translations > E-book (download) with aramaic english matthew syriac yhwh
www.nasrani-patriarchate.org/eng/peshitta/mrt/MattaiRMT2ed.pdf
 
* Sacred Name Bible: Sacred Name King James Version by John Hurt New window
As the King James Version of the Bible is the most widely accepted text in the English speaking world, it has been made the framework for the restoration of the Sacred Names for the Bible student. Whenever a Sacred Name is used, it has been placed in all capital letter, so as to be evident in the te ...morext. In verses where the Sacred Name did not exist in the original Hebrew or Greek text, but was added by the King James translators for readability purposes, it has been removed in this text. Some examples are the use of the phrase "God forbid" by the King James Translators, which has been restored to "Forbid", as there is no Sacred Name in the original Hebrew or Greek to restore (see Genesis 44:7, Gen 44:17, Joshua 22:29, Romans 3:4, Romans 3:31). Other exampl
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with bible yhwh
www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebiblecom/index.htm
 
* The Holy Bible Urim Thummim Version New window
Revision 2.05 2001 Dallas E. James. A revision of KJV/Youngs. Uses YHWH also in NT.
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with bible english yhwh
bibleprophet.com/
 
 
* The Scriptures New window
The online version of The Scriptures, a relatively new translation published by the Institute for Scripture Research.
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with english nt yhwh by 3 users
www.eliyah.com/thescriptures/
 
* The Scriptures New window
Uses the Tetragram also in the NT.
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with bible english yhwh by 3 users
www.eliyah.com/thescriptures/
 
 
* The Scriptures New window
in Online Bible Translations > Online reading with bible english yhwh by 3 users
www.eliyah.com/thescriptures/
 
THIRD, A letter on the subject by one of the world renown scholars on the subject, Rolf Furuli of the University of Oslo:
 
<<<" Dear Jan, The main point of your conclusion needs some elucidation. The word "Jews" is associated with the OT and the word "Christians" with the NT. It may not have been your intention, but the contrast you make between the two groups could lead the reader to conclude there is evidence that, at the time the NT was written the Hebrew letters of the tetragrammaton was no longer understood, and therefore the Christian NT writers used the substitute KURIOS. But such evidence is lacking! For the designations Jews/Christians to be meaningful to the reader, it is necessary to supply dates. As Greg has pointed out, all LXX manuscripts until 50 CE contained the tetragrammaton in some form; the form IAW which is found, even shows that it was pronunciated, because it is a phonetic transcription. The Christian manuscripts that have the Nomina sacra (KS with a bar above for KURIOS) instead of the tetragrammaton, were written about 150 CE. So there is no manuscript evidence before 150 CE that YHWH were substituted by KURIOS. When Jews and Christians are contrasted, we should keep in mind that all the NT writers were Jews who were followers of Jesus, and three points should be noted: 1) It cannot be demonstrated by manuscript finds or other finds that the pronunciation of YHWH had ceased in the days of Jesus, although some people at Qumran used a substitute. (The evidence for a substitution at Qumran is not unambiguous. For instance, 4Q408, which is dated to Hasmonean times (from the middle of the second century BCE), has the tetragrammaton in Aramaic script several times. Discoveries in the Judean Desert XXXVI, Comran Cave IV XXVI,2000, Oxford: Clarendon Press. Other older manuscripts use EL as a substitute for YHWH) 2) The NT writers spoke Hebrew or Aramaic where ADONAI and MARE/MARI (I do not use standard transcription which can be misunderstood on a Greek list) are the words that naturally would be translated by the Greek KURIOS. But neither ADONAI nor MARE/MARI are used as substitutes for YHWH at Qumran, but the substitute is EL. If the NT writers used KURIOS as a substitute for YHWH, they must have invented this practice themselves, because there is no evidence for a Hebrew or Aramaic antecedent, but why should they? NB, The Creator is called both YHWH and ADONAI in the Hebrew Bible, but ADONAI is not a *substitute* for YHWH. The word ADONAI is used only 83 times in non-biblical manuscripts at Qumran while EL is used 677 times. In the manuscript mentioned above, both ADONAI and YHWH are used for the Creator without one being a substitute for the other. 3) There is quite a lot of circumstansial evidence suggesting that the tetragrammaton occurred in the original NT. Elswhere I have argued for this at length, but I will supply one piece of evidence that the KURIOS in NT manuscripts after 150 CE, has different Hebrew antecedents. Compare John 21;7 "It is the Lord (KURIOS)." with Luke 1:46 "My soul magnifies the Lord (KURIOS). Which words did John and Mary use? In no case could John have used ADONAI, because that was a title (but not a substitute) for YHWH. But he evidently used another word. If the custom not to pronounce YHWH already was introduced, (which is completely without evidence), and Mary followed it, she could have used EL (as at Qumran) or ADONAI (although evidence for it being a substitute for YHWH is lacking). In any case John and Mary used two different words which manuscripts from 150 CE and younger translate as KURIOS. Because there are other Greek words in the semantic domain "Lord", the use of just one (KURIOS) for two different Hebrew words, could lead us to ask about the originality of KURIOS in the NT, because of all the confusion this creates. There is in fact circumstansial evidence suggesting the KURIOS in the NT in many instances is a *later* substitute for YHWH, while a form of YHWH occurred in the original manuscripts. As to the Christian origin of KURIOS as a substitute for YHWH, let me add that evidence in Syrohexapla and other Syriac manuscrips suggest that the tetragrammaton originally occurred in Syriac translations, and these manuscripts were made by Christians. Regards Rolf ">>>
 
FOURTH, <<<"Worldwide Assembly of YHWH By Robert J. Thiel
The Worldwide Assembly of YHWH (WAY) is a Houston, Texas based 'sacred name' group. Other than its emphasis on the specific name of the Father and the Son, their other basic beliefs appear to be consistent with most of the Churches of God. This article will quote some of WAY's statements (all taken from its website on 2/22/01) and then provide my comments, in italics, after them.
"Purpose Statement
To help all who truly want to: A. Seek YHWH's Kingdom (Matthew 6:33 - But seek you first the kingdom of YHWH, and his righteousness)" (WAY's first purpose statement).
This is fairly typical of 'sacred names' groups. They quote the New Testament as if it were written in Hebrew, instead of Greek. Actually, if you accept that the New Testament was written in Greek, then all the arguments of these types of groups are meaningless as God did not use much Hebrew in the New Testament. For what its worth, about 24 years ago I read a booklet from another 'sacred name' group which attempted to prove that the New Testament was written in Hebrew--suffice it to say that I did not believe the group was able to prove its point--as far as I (and 99+% of all scholars) can determine, the New Testament was written in Greek.
"Our beliefs are that there is only one Creator and his name is YHWH...Why use the name "YHWH" as oppose to the more commonly used name "GOD"? Would you believe that the name "GOD" is of pagan origin? As shocking as that statement is it is true and I challenge you to go down to your local library and do some research. Ask to see the Dictionary of Etymology the origins of American English words. Look up the word "GOD". You will see that the word "GOD" is not of English origin but comes from the Germanic tribe. Before the Germanic tribe converted to christianity they used this name for their pagan deity. How many times have we seen compromises made to bring non-believers into christianity?" (WAY's home page).
The term 'Lord' is used extensively in the New Testament. Its origins may be Babylonian. God apparently felt it was fine to inspire the writers of the New Testament to use that and other non-Hebrew names for deity. It should also be noted that the term 'christianity' has Greek as its origin.
"The appropriate name of the supreme Creator and sustainer of the entire universe is YHWH (Pronounced "YAH-WAY"). The appropriate name of our Savior the Messiah is Yahshua. The scriptures reveal to us the importance of our Creator's name." (WAY home page).
Sacred name groups always claim to know exactly how to pronounce the four Hebrew letters (which in English are approximated as YHWH) which have no vowels. These groups often do not agree with each other. The other group I looked into years ago said the proper pronounciation was Yah-vay. WAY is different from most in that it does not agree within itself on either name. The next statement is one found on WAY's website the same day I copied the previous statement:
 
"STATEMENT OF BELIEFS
 
1. APPROPRIATE NAMES The appropriate name of the supreme creator and sustainer of the entire universe is YHWH (Pronounced "YAHWEH"). The appropriate name of our Savior the Messiah is Yahùshua. The scriptures reveal to us the importance of our creator's name." (WAY's statement of beliefs). [source - Worldwide Assembly of YHWH By Robert J. Thiel]
 
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